by Alexandra Mrozowska
— Senior Columnist —
How many of you have been drawn to music because of escapism…? Actually, one of the best things about experiencing music is that you can immerse in it completely and escape reality, however harsh it might be. You can explore different worlds with Progressive Rock fairy tales and the epic sagas of Power Metal, or you can let the Glam Metal party anthems fuel your most debaucherous fantasies – the choice is yours! And it’s not rare that the artists who open the doors to those different worlds for their followers are escapists themselves. As Hardrock Haven caught up with Arjen Lucassen to discuss the newest Ayreon album Transitus, we didn’t only cover the details of the immersive story behind it. The escapist nature of our guest and his own little adolescent journeys into the world of music, comic books, sci-fi and musicals were perhaps even more important…
Hardrock Haven: The new Ayreon album Transitus being out now, what was the songwriting and recording process of it like, especially considering the number of people involved in it?
Arjen Lucassen: Basically, as you know, all my Ayreon albums have a lot of singers, so that was nothing new. The only thing that was new this time was that the whole project was set up to be a movie, not an album. That was very different for me, because usually I start with the music, I let the music inspire me to come up with the story and then I look for singers. But this time I knew it was going to be a movie. I also wanted the singers to be the actors in the movie, so it was a lot harder ‘cause I had to pick singers not just because of their voice, but also because of their charisma and the way the look – and also wonder if they could act or not. It was different, but I love challenges and I’m always looking for them.
Hardrock Haven: Speaking of the differences, Transitus seems to be less Metal and less Progressive than your other works. Do you agree and was it due to what this particular concept required, or were your inspirations different this time?
Arjen Lucassen: You’re totally right. Because it was set up to be a movie, I didn’t want to do a Metal album or a typical Prog album. It’s still going to be a movie – I hope! – and of course my hope is that one day it will be in the cinema. So, if I made a very complicated Progressive album or a very heavy Metal album, I wouldn’t draw that many people to the cinema (laughs). So that was my thought behind that. It’s also very cinematic – with every part that I was writing, I knew what would happen in the movie. Because of that, I wasn’t gonna write a long complicated instrumental part because I wouldn’t know what to do with the movie. So basically that’s why there are a lot of vocals and a narrator… it’s really much more cinematic and more like a Rock musical than a Rock opera.
Hardrock Haven: In general, are you inspired by musicals?
Arjen Lucassen: Yeah, it definitely started for me when I heard Jesus Christ Superstar. I think I was ten or eleven… And I loved it! I took the booklet, I read the lyrics, I saw these images and I totally escaped into that world. Later on, there was The War Of The Worlds – the same thing. With the voice of Richard Burton talking, and those Martians coming to Earth, I escaped reality for like an hour (laughs). I’ve always totally loved that, and later on of course you got the movies; you got the movie for Jesus Christ Superstar which was great or Tommy which was great as well… Being a part of Rock bands earlier on, I wasn’t able to do this, but once I started on my own – I think it was in 1995 with the Ayreon project – I could finally realize that dream of making a Rock opera myself.
Hardrock Haven: Different medieval instruments, including glockenspiel, hurdy-gurdy and dulcimer, were used during the recordings. Where did the idea for that come from?
Arjen Lucassen: Basically, I was listening to a lot of soundtracks, for instance by Ennio Morricone. And what I love about this music is that there were a lot of strange sounds, like whistling or da-da-dah (laughs) and all those little guitars and stuff like that… So I really wanted that effect. I was also inspired by “Tubular Bells” – the music that was used in the horror movie The Exorcist – you know, you had this piano going but also a glockenspiel going with it, and it gave it such a creepy, weird sound… So I wanted this album to be very warm and real, and that’s why I used a lot of instruments that I never used before.
Hardrock Haven: As you’ve already mentioned, typically for Ayreon, Transitus includes a lot of guest singers and musicians. Do you match the singers with the existing characters in the particular story, or do you write with particular singers in mind?
Arjen Lucassen: The singers come first, always. It’s easier to write a character for a singer, than to look for a singer with the character in mind. Also, you’re limited if you already created a character and then you get to pick the singer. A good example of that is on the third Ayreon album Into The Electric Castle [1998], where I had [ex-Marillion singer] Fish singing “The Highlander”. So it wasn’t like I put “The Highlander” in the story and I needed a Scottish person, but the other way around – I had a Scottish person, so I wrote “The Highlander” in the story. That makes it a lot easier for me and also, it fits the singer much better. So it’s first the singer, than the character. And also, on Transitus – for example, the role of Angel of Death was totally written for Simone [Simons, of Epica]. It was like, I needed a good part for Simone and I came up with this kind of naughty, sexy Angel of Death and there wouldn’t have been that role at all in my story if it hadn’t been for Simone.
Hardrock Haven: So you can say that it’s the singer who actually inspires the character…
Arjen Lucassen: Totally. For example, on this album [Transitus] there’s a song called “Dumb Piece Of Rock”, which is about a statue that comes to life. And again, I’m a big fan of Mike Mills who sang that part but firstly, I didn’t have the part for him at all. And I was like, “Shit, I gotta have him on the album so I have to think of a good part for him” (laughs). Finally I came up with the part of him becoming a statue and that was totally something I could see him do, ‘cause he’s a crazy guy with a great sense of humor and I remember when I told him “Hey man, I’ve got a part for you on my new album but I don’t know if you’re gonna like it because you’re gonna be a dumb piece of rock.” And he said, “Hey, I’ll play a banana if you want. (laughs). If I can be on Ayreon, I’ll be a banana” (laughs). And also, the same thing was with Cammie [Gilbert] on this album. Firstly, the main parts were going to be Tommy [Karevik, of Kamelot] as the rich man’s son and Simone as a servant girl. But then I heard Cammie and I loved her voice and I was looking for a part for her on the album. And then I thought that it would make the story so much more interesting if there was a real taboo in the nineteenth century, if there was a relationship between the rich man’s girl and the black servant. So I asked her [Cammie] and I told her I’ve got a part for her, and when I explained the story to her she was like, “Oh, that’s so cool and that would make the story so much more interesting.” So because of that, I had to find a different character for Simone… It’s a weird way that I work (laughs). It’s not like writing a story and looking for actors but more about which actors you’re gonna get and what cool parts you can write for them.
Hardrock Haven: So, in a way, the story has a life of its own…
Arjen Lucassen: Absolutely. That’s the way I work. And I had to learn that. When I started with Ayreon, the story was finished and the singers had to do exactly what I wanted and I had to stick with the story. And then, at some point, you work with big names, you work with Bruce Dickinson of Iron Maiden or you work with James LaBrie [Dream Theater] or Mikael Akerfeldt [Opeth] or Devin Townsend… You know, these are all my heroes and you don’t tell them what to do (laughs). They do their own thing. And then the next thing you know is that it’s getting so much better, the end result is so much better. So at some point I’ve learned that you have to keep changing, you have to keep adapting and definitely not stick to the original plan but constantly evolve so the end result is so much better because of that.
Hardrock Haven: Transitus being a finished story, is there any song on the album that you think could stand on its own, without the narrative and the context?
Arjen Lucassen: That’s a very good question. And the answer may surprise you, but I think no (laughs). The record company asked me which song I want to release as a single and I said I don’t want to do a single at all! It’s one big story and you can’t just pick out a single song because none of the song will be representative of this album, whichever you may pick. So they said, “Yeah, but we gotta do some videos”. And then I said “Okay, but at least let’s choose two songs at once. Let’s pick like a really heavy song and let’s pick a really soft song so that people will realize that there are so many different styles on the album.” One of the songs is “Get Out! Now” with Dee Snider [Twisted Sister] which is a totally ‘80s Hard Rock track, you know… totally not representative of the album and so much different than all the other songs. But in the story, it works as there’s a function for that song. But if people heard just that song, they would think “Oh, this is an ‘80s Hard Rock album” while it’s not. So at the same time, we released “Hopelessly Slipping Away” which is a very atmospheric song – mysterious, almost acoustic, with lots of violin… So, I think it’s a good way to show two sides of the story. But this album wasn’t written with singles in mind, like with tracks that could stand on their own. It’s really a big story with also a lot of leitmotifs that keep coming back, a lot of patterns that keep coming back five times on the album. To me, it’s not background music, it’s really something you should put on, put your headphones on and follow the whole story along.
Hardrock Haven: So with Transitus being this big story and us suffering from the short attention span these days, do you still think such an elaborate project as Ayreon is still going to reach its target audience?
Arjen Lucassen: Again, a good question! (laughs). Apparently yes (laughs), because it’s selling like crazy – I think it’s my best-selling album already now. A lot of formats are sold out – we made four different vinyls but the gold and read are sold out and the earbooks we also made are sold out as well… The sales are going crazy. I refuse to give in to the quick YouTube generation – like you just look at something for ten or twenty seconds and go to the next one. It’s just not what I do and I just know there’s an audience who still wants to escape, who takes their time with it… who takes the booklet out, who sits down, put their headphones on, a glass of wine, some candles, whatever… Like a movie, you know… It’s weird but people still watch movies, so why wouldn’t they listen to music for that long…? So luckily there’s still an audience for that, but yeah, it might get more difficult with the younger generation growing up. But having said that, I still get so many e-mails from kids who say, “Hey, I hate my parents’ albums (laughs), but I heard Ayreon in the car and I loved it and I wanna hear more and what’s the story about”. There is still hope.
Hardrock Haven: You’ve just mentioned the special limited edition of Transitus being also released. How do you think all this, especially the earbook including DVDs, a CD with guide vocals, a graphic novel etc., contributes to the overall experience of listening to the album?
Arjen Lucassen: It’s very important. It was so important for me when I grew up… I grew up in the vinyl era, and back then you had all the double albums and the double sleeves… I loved album artwork and there’s a lot of albums I bought because of the artwork. Also, reading the lyrics along… It’s a special experience and I think my fans understand that because they still buy the physical product even though they could just listen to it on Spotify. It’s just something special, you know, it’s like you’re get this present at home and you can open it up and there’s a lot of goodies in it… I love to spoil the fans somehow, like I loved to be spoiled when I was a kid. I want to give them the same feeling that I had when I got Pink Floyd’s The Wall with its beautiful artwork and all those pictures… Then, [editions] with DVD with the making-of, and instrumental CDs, and CDs with guide vocals and videoclips and stuff like that… I think it’s extremely important and it’s the way my music should be experienced. You know, if you’re doing the washing-up and you’re having Ayreon in the background, it’s just annoying music (laughs).
Hardrock Haven: And it doesn’t work at all (laughs).
Arjen Lucassen: No, not at all (laughs). I could totally understand people hating it, like, “Hey, turn it off and put on ABBA or something.” (laughs)
Hardrock Haven: Indeed! So with Transitus actually being a movie project, and you citing movies as a source of inspiration in the past, what else does inspire your artistic endeavors?
Arjen Lucassen: Well, believe it or not, but I’ve never read the book in my life, so it’s definitely not books (laughs). My mother tried to make me read books, but I hated it even more because of that (laughs). I don’t know, I don’t have the patience and focus and I just can’t sit [in one place], so it’s just that. So yes, movies were very important for me. And of course the music itself… Also, comic books. That’s why I did a comic book with this album; I loved comic books when I grew up. First it was like the typical Dutch funny comic books, but then I found short horror and sci-fi stories like in Creepy and Eerie [American magazines of horror comics introduced by Warren Publishing in the ‘60s] and stuff like that… I loved that. And also the Marvel stuff like Spiderman for example. It was really funny and I remember I collected all the Spiderman comics. So yeah, comic books – and pretty much all the nerdy things (laughs). I’m a total nerd (laughs).
Hardrock Haven: So back to Transitus, how does a story behind it fit into the Ayreon universe? Does it correspond in any way with the previous albums?
Arjen Lucassen: Basically, it does not correspond with them at all because it wasn’t planned to be an Ayreon album, so it’s not a part of the Ayreon universe. However, once I’m working on it, I always get these links to the Ayreon universe. It always happens. On this album, there are little links like the song “This Human Equation” which is of course a reference to the earlier Ayreon album The Human Equation [2004]. If you read the coming book, you can see some images of Ayreon’s album covers… As I’m working on it, there are always some links. It was the same with The Human Equation album I did with Ayreon. It was not a part of the Ayreon universe, but in the end it all appeared to be a computer simulation inside the computer called The Dream Sequencer which was also an earlier Ayreon album [released in 2000]. So, there are always little references and links, but basically the plan was that it would be a standalone story.
Hardrock Haven: To oversimplify it perhaps, Transitus is a story of love and death. Do you think that in spite of how extensively these themes were used, they are still an endless source of inspiration?
Arjen Lucassen: I think so. It’s hard to be original and it’s hard not to repeat things. But maybe for me it’s a bit easier, ‘cause as I told you I’ve never read the book in my life (laughs). So, I wrote this story and people are comparing it to books while I’m like, ‘Oh, well… cool” (laughs). Like I’ve never read a book in my life, but it’s cool that someone compares me to the story that I’ve never heard. But it gets harder and harder to be original, that’s a fact, and I wrote a song about it on my solo album – it’s called “Pink Beatles In A Purple Zeppelin” and the first lines are “Every song’s been sung before/Every note’s been played…” But it’s actually true. That’s why I try to put new things into it, I try not to repeat myself, I try not to copy others… and for instance, on this album – like you’ve already said – by using all those new instruments, by working with new singers all the time, by working with younger singers and younger musicians… that’s also very important for me to keep it interesting. Not only for the fans, but also for myself. I always look for challenges and for previous Ayreon albums I always wrote sci-fi stories and stuff like that. So, a love story, a romantic story, a ghost story like this set in the nineteenth century is a challenge for me ‘cause I’ve never done it before. But I’m sure that people will find a lot of comparisons to already existing stories, that always happens.
Hardrock Haven: Guess you just can’t avoid it. A huge part of the storyline of Transitus happens in the afterlife. Is it a manifestation of your personal spiritual beliefs and of how you imagine afterlife?
Arjen Lucassen: A lot of people think that I’m very spiritual and deep and stuff like that (laughs), but I’m afraid I have to disappoint them (laughs). I’m more of a science guy… Although I’m really bad at Maths, so maybe I’m not a science guy (laughs). I love taking science and turning it into fiction, I love to fantasize… but do I believe in aliens, do I believe in afterlife…? To be honest, I really hope there’s no afterlife, because eternity is a damn long time, you know (laughs). It would be really scary for me that once you die, you’re still floating around – you’ve got no body, you’ve got no eyes, you’ve got no hands, you’ve got nothing… Eternity is like forever, and it’s very scary for me to think that there would be an afterlife. ‘Cause I don’t think about angels or devils and stuff like that… So in general, my answer would have to be no.
Hardrock Haven: As you’ve already mentioned, the story of Transitus is set in the 1880s, and yet do you think it could happen at any period, including the contemporary era?
Arjen Lucassen: Well, it’s becoming sort of universal story. Of course, in the nineteenth century, a relationship between a rich man’s son and a black servant is totally a taboo but it looks like nowadays with the whole Black Lives Matter movement it’s all becoming a taboo again… It’s such a shame that this is happening. So yeah, maybe somehow it’s current again. As I was writing the story, the whole Black Lives Matter thing didn’t happen yet, but of course people are saying now, “Oh, were you inspired by that?” But that’s not the case at all. As you may know, I’m a total recluse. I don’t watch the news, I don’t read newspapers and I have no idea what’s going on in the world in general (laughs).
Hardrock Haven: Good for you! (laughs)
Arjen Lucassen: Yeah, if I do, it drives me crazy. If now I happen to see something on Facebook or whatever, all these conspiracy theories and stuff… oh man, it drives me crazy. I’d rather not know about it. Also, I’d rather not force my opinion on people. I don’t wanna say there’s no afterlife for instance… It’s not my task as a musician. My task is offer escapism, and that’s what I try to do. But having said that, there is a lot to read between the lines. If you really do your best, you will always see my personal opinion between the lines – especially if you listen to my solo album, Lost In The New Real [2012]. There’s a lot of myself on that album.
Hardrock Haven: I think escapism is a word used the most often as we talk, so was it what actually drew you to music?
Arjen Lucassen: Oh yeah, totally! It was really escapism for me. Like I said, I was really a nerd, you know, and I wanted to escape. Other kids were playing outside and I was in my room with curtains closed, reading a comic book and listening to Black Sabbath and Pink Floyd and Deep Purple and The Beatles… And I was perfectly happy, you know…? It wasn’t like I was an unhappy kid and I didn’t wanna be with others. I was perfectly happy on my own in my own fantasy world and my own bubble (laughs). And luckily now my hobby has become my profession which is great because now I’m able to create this bubble around me and even spoil or please a lot of fans with it. That’s a great feeling.
Hardrock Haven: Must be! So, looking back, what works of yours are you the most proud of? Is there any album you consider special for some particular reason?
Arjen Lucassen: Yeah, like I said, my solo album Lost In The New Real ‘cause that’s a hundred per cent me. It’s the album I’m most happy with. If I listen to it now, I’m like, “Hey, this is cool” (laughs). I don’t think I can do a better album and it’s totally me, so eclectic, so many different styles… And I know that I’m not a great singer, but nevertheless it’s a very personal album. Especially the track “Lost In The New Real” which is like a ten-minute track with all these different little parts… I’m very proud of that one. Apart from that, if people ask me what’s Ayreon about, or what should they check out if they wanna check out Ayreon, I mostly send them a link to the clip “The Day That The World Breaks Down”, a track from the previous Ayreon album The Source.‘Cause again, it’s a thirteen-minute track and it also has many different styles in it as well as amazing singers and a very cool clip… so usually when I wanna introduce myself to people I send them these two songs, “The Day That The World Breaks Down” and “Lost In The New Real” of my solo album.
Hardrock Haven: You’ve just mentioned your singing on your solo album, and obviously with Ayreon we have all those guest singers, so what are the differences in songwriting when you write for yourself and when you write for Ayreon?
Arjen Lucassen: It gets very, very different when I write for other singers. Me, I’m not a Metal singer. I don’t have a powerful voice and I can’t sing high notes with a beautiful vibrato and stuff like that… So usually when I write for myself it’s more like in the vein of The Beatles or Pink Floyd and that kind of music which is suitable for my style of singing and also, even my style of guitar playing. But when I do Ayreon, I have all those amazing singers at my disposal and it opens up a lot of possibilities. People often say, “Oh, you’re a genius ‘cause you work with so many singers on an album,” but it’s not genius. It just makes my life so much easier (laughs) and my work so much easier ‘cause you have all these different singers who are amazing and you can show off their talents and mix them… First, you got a low song and you’ve got Jonas Renkse of Katatonia, then you’ve got those high parts and you can put in Russell Allen and you’ve got this mysterious part and you can put in Damian Wilson… for this powerful high female parts you can put in Floor Jansen… It’s a luxury, you know, pure luxury to write for these great singers.
Hardrock Haven: A lot of Ayreon’s works, like the song “Computer Reign (Game Over)” for example, sound more and more prophetic as time goes by. What do you think is the future of the relationship between a human being and technology and is it as terrifying as in the song I’ve mentioned?
Arjen Lucassen: Well, basically that’s the recurring theme of all my albums and if you look at the ‘big’ Ayreon story, that’s how the Forever race lost all their emotions because they were completely dependent on technology. I grew up in the time before computers, so I’ve seen how fast it goes. It took only twenty years for the world to completely change and people look at the phones all the time and so on… That’s the cliché, you know. I honestly can’t say if it’s a good or bad thing, ‘cause when I was young and I was watching TV, my grandfather would say “Oh, in our days we only had the radio and we sat around the radio!… How can you watch TV all day?” But I had a lot of fun watching TV and I totally enjoyed it – and I still do. So if I say to kids now, “What’s the use of playing games on your phone all day?”, maybe they have a great time doing it…? I don’t know, but one thing’s sure – I can’t predict the future. Of course I try to do it in my stories. The way I see it is that technology’s taken more and more control over us and it’s not good – but I could be wrong…
Hardrock Haven: Is there anything you’d like to add in the end?
Arjen Lucassen: I think I talked a lot and I’ve said everything I wanted to say… (laughs) So, it’s just thank you very much!
Visit Arjen Lucassen online: https://www.arjenlucassen.com/
